Rear Riser Anti-Slip Gel Pad

Great pad just what I wanted

Absolutely love it. Have an 8 yr old TWH and it’s only improved her gaits. Definitely like riding on a cloud. My mare loves it too. Can’t go wrong if you’re on the fence about buying one.

I purchased the rear riser gel pad and I can't say enough good things about it! My dressage saddle is perfectly balanced now and it doesn't slip sideways on my "round" barreled Arabian. I highly recommend it if you are having issues

This riser pad is perfect

I can feel that my horse is happier and her gaits feel more energetic. As a veterinarian, I never thought a saddle pad would make that big a difference, a horse is either sound or not. I was wrong. Now I'm believer!

I purchased the rear riser and was concerned that the rise might put more unwanted pressure behind the shoulders. Because the gel material is so squishy and forgiving, there was no added weight to the front of the saddle. The rise helped to balance my dressage saddle without creating pressure elsewhere. My saddle has been fitted to my horse and has regular checks to make sure that this saddle fits correctly, but it needed just a bit of lift to correct my balance and this pad fits the bill. I would recommend this pad!

I absolutely love this pad! It keeps my saddle in place and I use it with my Kavallerie Air Gel pad and levels my saddle out where it needs to be and gives my horse the protection his topline needs. If you have an older horse or one with high withers these pads are the best!

I’m really happy with the quality of this product, has made a big difference to my son’s mare who is getting older and not holding her top line muscle as well as she used to! Happy horse and happy rider. Also arrived really quickly after order was placed and was kept up to date every step of the process.

Im Usually skeptic about saddle pads and go thru about 3 high impact pads a year they seem to crush or fall flat with alot of use. The good news is im really thrilled about Kavalleri gel pads so far it been my go to on all my horses and recommend these pads plus the company asked ME how everything was now thats a company that cares.

It's hard to find a good gel pad these days. This one is better than then ones they made 20-30 years ago, which are no longer available anyway plus you can get it with lift back or front etc. It's super squishy so really fixes saddle fit issues, is not bulky at all so you're still close to the horse. I love it.

Got the riser back for a young client that isn’t so soft in the saddle. You no longer see the saddle slapping or bounding. No more sore back. This is a must own.

Great for my 16.3 hand, refined mare with high withers. It is not as effective on my 17 hand wide gelding.

My horse has a back that is hard to find a saddle for so I’m using my old dressage saddle that fits him okay but bridges off his back a little. I got this gel pad to help with that. He seems to like it a lot and moves out really well (he’s gaited) with is pad, however it doesn’t change the sweat marks on the saddle pad after the ride. So in short my saddle still doesn’t fit my horse, but I believe this pad will keep him from getting sore spots. I rode him the other day in another saddle that didn’t fit and was a bit narrow in the withers and it was very hard to get him to gait out. If anything I feel better riding with this pad under my dressage saddle while I wait to have it re-flocked for him. It also doesn’t slip.

I got this for my 16.1 hand, high-ish withered, and slightly sway-backed warmblood. My 18' devacoux jumping saddle fits him really pretty well, however the saddle slipped back quite a bit, and I felt that we could use just a little bit of a lift in the back. I've found that a combination of the Kavallerie between the saddle and rug, and a gel-eze pad underneath the rug keeps my saddle perfectly in place. I don't even need a breastplate when I ride with these. The lifting affect of this pad is slight, which serves my needs perfectly. If you need a lot of lift, this pad won't do it for you. However, I don't believe it's a good idea to try and make a poorly fitting saddle work with pads. I wish this pad came in white so I could show in it. My showpad has shims in the back, but I need a breastplate to prevent sliding. This pad fits my saddle fine, but if yours is much bigger than 18', I don't think this pad will work for you.

I’ve had the front riser pad for over two years now and I love it. Since I use it as a bridge pad, the front padded areas fit right into the hollowed areas behind my 27 year old mule’s shoulders. This caused the pad to stick out past the rounded skirt of my western endurance saddle. The pad came with an creased area across the back to allow for trimming which was easily done with scissors and the pad fit perfectly within the rear skirt. I recently road for four days in the mountains and my saddle did not slip and my mule’s back wasn’t sore. As recommended, I place the gel pad over top of my thin saddle blanket and everything stays in place, even after a five hour ride. I have a custom made saddle for my mule but after 15 years I took it and mule back to saddle maker to verify the new gel pad placement was correct for my mule’s aging back. The saddle maker liked the gel pad a lot and wanted more information about it. I’ve kept the pad inside my trailer year around stored on a round PVC pipe so I’m not sure if the construction had changed since I purchased mine in early 2017 but there has been no tearing or disintegration like others have mentioned. I’ve considered purchasing another pad just in case something happens to this one but I’m concerned the quality may not be the same now. I’ll keep watching the reviews.

I have several OTTB's whose backs are constantly changing as they develop muscle tone and grow from young race horses into performance horses. Having a pad that provides comfort and grip to a changing back is very important to me. I ordered the riser pad and I love the sleek design for my schooling horses that just need extra cushion and rise in the back. For my TB's that have changing backs and high withers, the Kavallerie pad keeps my saddle sturdy and adds comfort as it forms to the back of my horse. "Squishy" are the words I use when I tell my students about this pad, explaining to them how I can use it with my different saddles, knowing with peace of mind that my horses back are taken care of. I look forward to using this pad on my horses for many more years, and I think this pad will be durable enough to withstand whatever you use it for. Cleaning is a breeze, you just have to hose it off! Compared to most gel pads, they are the same thickness through and offer no more than grip, which eventually wears down. I highly recommend this pad to use for the comfort of both the everyday schooling horse and performances horses that need the gel design to reduce saddle slipping and movement.

This pad is awesome! It did its job protecting my horse's withers and so I know he was much more comfortable. Compared to other pads I have used, it made me feel more comfortable in my saddle and on my horse.

I first borrowed a gel half pad from a friend at the barn to slightly raise the back of my saddle, as my gelding's back has changed with age. It not only did the trick to help with the lift, but my horse loved it. He felt good under the saddle, he was happier at work, and I believe it is due to the gel and how it helps absorb the impact. This is a great quality product!

My horse and I loved it. What a difference. I thought that my saddle fit but using this pad really leveled the saddle for a proper fit.

My horse loves the way the back riser lifts off the weight from her sensitive back. It is very soft, yet provides the needed support where it wanted.

I've been using this pad every time I ride which is two or three times per week, for the last month or so. My slightly swayback 10 year old gelding is seems much more comfortable, and certainly the sweat pattern on his back is much more uniform in fact I would say perfect since switching to the pad, which it had not been before. I rated absorbency low because I don't think it's at all absorbent but I don't think that's its job. As far as fixing a bridging problem on a swayback horse the pad work perfectly for me. Couldn't be happier.

Anything that makes a horse more comfortable on the trail is a big plus. Happy horse means happy rider.

Excellent!

Fits my old gelding very well.

This middle riser gel pad fixed my aging slightly sway backed horse's saddle fit. Even my saddle fitter was impressed and said she would probably buy a couple to have in her stock. I did have some cracking on the one I received and the company was very responsive and sent out a new one. I will need to be careful that it doesn't get heated so will need to store in climate control area during hot summer months. UPDATE: Received my new pad, it is PERFECT! This is a GREAT seller and a GREAT pad. My horse even hums when I ride with it. I would definitely recommend this company!!!

I really do think this helps with sore backs. But this does not fit my saddle perfectly I mean it works but in order for the half pad to be on correctly like 2 inches are hanging off the saddle pad. This would be even better if the extra material was cut off. But other wise its a great product and would recommend this as a cheaper alternative to the expensive thin line half pads

I read the reviews on this pad and really liked it. I was worried it would not fit under my roper saddle, even though it is only a 14' seat. My 3 year old quarter horse colt went through his lanky high wither stage and my saddle was putting too much pressure on him. I couldnt buy a $250 gel pad for some time and decided to buy this as a place holder. My saddle has full QH bars. It fits perfectly underneath, the material keeps it in place on the pad, and I see a noticeable difference in my colts movement and demeanor. I love having this on hand!

Me encanta, bonito, suave y muy buena calidad

My daughter absolutely loves this riser. The horse seems to be very comfortable with the riser as well. It has helped another restless riding horse from bucking and tossing his head when being rode.

I am an endurance rider and my horse's lower back kept turning up sore - vet suggested, among other things, a rear riser saddle pad...it has been the answer!

It provides the relief I was looking for my horses back! Thank you!

This fits my 14.3hh wide mare perfectly and has helped get better support at her withers.

I bought this pad about two weeks ago to help with back soreness. I didn't want something too thick that would cause saddle fitting problems, as it already fitting correctly but needed additional padding for my TW/Thoroughbred cross. He has always had a sensitive back and I have tried several pads that have not worked.When i first saw this pad, I loved that it had the gel padding on top and the additional non slip texture on the underside as well. I was a little nervous about the length of the pad because I ride in a 17in seat and didn't want the pad to stick out too far in the back.After receiving this pad, I imminently noticed the quality of the pad, gel pieces and fleece. It is very well made w/ great quality materials.Secondly, I really liked the fit under my saddle and it provided additional cushion far enough back that I would protect the area that my horse was usually sore. It also includes the straps to attach to the saddle, which is a nice feature.Thirdly, the first time i rode with this pad i was competing in a Mounted Games competition so there is a LOT of movement (hanging off the side of the saddle at high speeds, weaving in and out of objects and lots of dismounts and vaulting back on) and the pad never moved!!!Most importantly, MY HORSE HASNT BEEN BACK SORE SINCE AND I DIDNT HAVE TO COMPROMISE SADDLE FIT!!My horse and I are so happy to have found this pad and can't wait to get more of these items in the future! highly recommend!!

My mule has a sore spot on her back that has caused trouble for years. This pad takes the pressure off that spot when I tack her up, and I have had no issues since I started using it. It's fantastic!

This solved a fitting issue with my saddle

Used to ride with a Total Saddle Fit Fleece pad until I heard about the Kavallerie Gel Half Pad.Ordered one just to give it a try and am absolutely loving it! The horse stays much cooler with it in the hot summer months in the South. In addition he seems to be moving nicer and my saddle just stays in place.One of the products that actually delivers on what is being promised and couldn't be happier with it. In addition it is so much easier to care for than the fleece pad I had. Simply rinse it off when you are done riding. I haven't tried to put it in my washing machine yet, as I honestly didn't have to.Stuck to itself for the first couple of weeks, but that sorted itself out as well after a few rides.Mine apparently had a little tear in it (which didn't seem to compromise the functionality of the pad) and I just emailed customer support and asked them about it. Alex at Kavallerie was super quick in replying and just wanted to make it right, so I got a replacement with no questions asked. The entire process including shipping and delivery took less than a week.Truly happy to have found a company that backs their product 100% and provides superb customer service if needed!Highly recommend this pad!

Very high quality item, easily compares to the $200-300 half pads I see in tack stores... The only issue (and the reason I removed one star) is that was a bit too long for my 17' saddle. I believe it would fit a 17 1/2 or 18' saddle better... but my horse does like it very much and I can feel that it does help with shock absorbing a lot, which is super important to us Jumpers!

Love this product. Really helped my horse's high withers and thin frame. Raised the pommel and tree up off his sore back. Highly recommend.

Great quality and nice ergonomically balanced and symmetrical pad.

Great for every day support. Love it for the OTTB right off the track with sore backs. Washes really well. Only downfall would be it is one size so it will stick out further on small saddles.

Great pad. My horse really appreciated it today it allowed his shoulders to move freely and the saddle was balanced - seat was lifted just right amount without tipping on his shoulders. It also was much more comfortable for me than the lollipop rear riser, which is too springy.

excelent

My horse has a high whither that drops down so finding a saddle/saddle pad combo has been difficult, but he seems to really like this half pad and it keeps my saddle in place with out slipping back. My only complaint is the Wool like material is falling off in places, which is why I gave it 4 stars

This half pad is a GIFT FROM GOD. Love it. Got it because I needed a half pad with more anti slip quality for my little short backed super sensitive mare. Needless to say it fixed the problem better than everything else ive tried and I am a half pad hoarder. It is very sticky right out of the box so you definitely want to keep it covered when not in use as dirt will stick! Hopefully the stick doesnt wear off too much. Either way I am definitly ordering another one for my other horses as soon as I get paid!

Worked great for my lesson horse! Saddle didnt move at all!!

Great pad! Comfortable, stays put, and gives the right amount of rise in the back where needed for a high withered horse!

Seems to be doing the trick on a new horse that does not have his top line muscled up yet. Lifting yer back of my saddle up off his spine.

Kavallerie stood behind their product after a tear down the spin and shipped a replacement.

I got the front riser pad to help balance out my saddle while my out-of-shape horse develops his topline a bit, but the front rise was just a bit too extreme for us and caused some significant bridging of the saddle - I didn't even ride with it, I just took it off and put it back in the box. If you need a good deal of lift, this pad is probably worth it, with a caveat: I don't know how much the gel would compress down with a rider's weight but unless it squishes down a good bit, my concern would be that if this much lift is needed, you might have an issue with saddle fit that is more than a pad could *or should* fix. Check for bridging before you ride. Depends, as always, on the horse and saddle and rider; consult a saddle fitter if you can, etc. Overall, seems very shock-absorbent and you can hose it down to clean it off. The regular gel (non-lift version) pad might work fine for some extra cushion, but I already have a good sheepskin half pad I can use for that so I won't be trying the flat gel pad out for myself.

I love this!

A little pricey but my horse seems to be very comfortable with this pad

Seems pretty flexible, coolsupportive so far.

awesome pad..

Great gel pad for our Mare, my daughter loved it

Works great

Product works as advertised. Stated very prominently designed for english saddles but will work with western. I use it on my western saddle and while it just covers the tree points on the withers it would be nice if a larger one was made specifically for western saddles. Again it is very prominently stated for english.

This gel pad fit my 18' dressage saddle perfectly and eliminated the side to side slipping of my saddle. It does not add bulk under the saddle and is shock absorbing without rebound. Very happy with this gel pad.

This is a beautiful half pad, just not what I was looking for. Its certainly fairly priced I think, just a little too thick. My dressage trainer was concerned about the bulkiness & I found out why when it started slipping... Unfortunately, I plan to return the item

Okay, first off, this pad is huge. It's very long and very thick and it would be great as an everyday or trail type of pad, but it does NOT work for showing. Pair it with a square or baby pad and you'll be set, just no contoured ones. I ended up having to return it because I bought it for the purpose of showing in Hunters and it just did not work with my 17' CC saddle.If you're looking for something that's thick and squishy, then this is the pad for you, it's not like one of those Thin-line type gel pads, the standard, non-riser version of this pad is probably close to an inch at it's thickest points. There is a nice spine-free channel and the pad has a good 'grip' but it can be kinda weird to pull up into the gullet especially at first because it basically glues it's self to the panels of the saddle. It would probably work a lot easier with a Wintec synthetic type rather than a leather one. It was a bit of a task to pull it off of the cardboard backing it game with because it acted like one of those gel window cling decorations, but honestly it was more amusing than frustrating.I wish I could afford to keep it because it would be a dream for those three hour long trail rides, but alas, that's not possible.If you fit the niche it's works for than you will love this pad...sadly I don't :(

Love this half pad! Very good quality and at a bargain as well!! It fits best with 17'+ saddles as it looks a little large on my 16.5' jump saddle, but looks perfect on my 17' dressage saddle! Definitely recommend this half pad!

I've used it a couple of times. My horse seems to be comfortable and so am I.

This pad was exactly what I was looking for. I just needed a small lift in the front while my baby horse fills out with out adding bulk. My horse feels better under saddle when I ride with this pad.

Very pleased! Lots of other riders at the barn think it's awesome and plan on ordering one too. Definitely fits an 17' and plus saddle very well.

I am using this Gel Half Pad for a western saddle. My horse has a contoured back and this pad gives good contact on all parts of the saddle. I like the tackiness of the pad because it stays in place on top of the 1/2' contoured saddle pad. I have tried other bridge pads that have a tendency to slide around. With this one, I have good comfort for my horse and can still use my western pad.

This works really well for my High withered TB. And way cheaper than an Ogilvy Half Pad.

really like this; it helps the saddle stay in place

Nice and thick, really does what it advertises, also helps keep your saddle from slipping. Light weight so does not add more to your traveling load!

My older schoolmaster has slight sway to his back and was demonstrating possible back soreness by a shortened gate. I have used the midrise gel pad a few times now and do see an improvement in his lovely forward trot. The gel pad is lightweight and fits well under saddle. should be fine for shows. A real bonus, the saddle stays in place. The very expensive half pad in tried slipped and I was off center most of my ride.

I love this pad to help with shock absorption. It doesn't move around under the saddle or bunch so it's perfect for me. Even when just carrying this around you can feel how it would absorb shock and make riding more comfortable for horses.The only thing I don't love about this saddle pad is its a bit sticky, so when I inevitably drop it on the barn floor, it picks up hay and dust. That said, it's super easy to clean! I just wipe it off with a baby wipe when I drop it. It's a lot easier to deep clean than a traditional pad since it doesn't hold onto hair and dirt as much as a traditional cloth pad. Overall, I am very happy with this pad.

It really seems to work well on my 17 H TB who is fairly narrow at the withers. I have struggled to find pads that keep his back comfortable.in the past. My trainer likes it too and she is super fussy. She even asked if it came in white so we could show with it?

The Kavallerie Gel Half Pad is so much more than I expected! My saddle fits my horse very well, and most half pads add to much bulk where it causes pressure points. I needed something that was just enough cushion to add shock absorption, and the Kavallerie Gel Pad did just that! My horse is extremely happy under it, and I'm happy that she's happy.I am 110% sold on Kavallerie and will continue to promote it during show season :)

We love it it is helping my old mare with her back. We ride western.

These are wonderful, especially if you have multiple horses using the same saddle!

Awesome product, very satisfied

It's an awesome pad!! For my flat withered, flat back Appaloosa it is the best utilizing the center riser style. I was able to eliminate a memory gel pad and reduce the cinching gap. My horse is pleased :)

This pad is the best! Comfy (for me & my horse), doesn't slip and holds the saddle in place even on a rounder horse. I've always had pads slip and got so used to 'straightening' them (pushing down on one stirrup or the other) after a corner or whatever, got tiring! Wonderful! Kind of a 'sticky' type gel material. Just great. Other people at my barn are asking about it... I would not give up this pad...ever!!

I ABSOLUTELY love my pad! My mare does too! She's an 18 year old TB with withers like a shark fin! The front riser pads lifts my saddle off of her withers, giving her more room, and the shock absorbing function of the saddle protects her back, making my tiny little mare even happier with her ears forward the entire ride!

Fantastic product - perfect for a Thoroughbred that dips below the wither behind the shoulder blade. We have used it with an Jump saddle and Half-breed Stock saddle.

These gel pads are great! I have the front riser pad for my horse with high withers and it helps where he is under-muscled. Also because of his high withers saddles tend to slip back and the gel pad helps keep everything in place! Great quality and easy to clean. I would recommend it even for those who have custom fit saddles as it acts as a shock absorber and gives a little comfort without overly lick padding or compression like a memory foam half pad.

I love my pad! I got it in the mail and was so excited to try. It helped my saddle stay in place through the whole ride and helped circulate air onto his back! It kept My horse cooler as we did a hard workout. It's awesome and I would definitely recommend it. It's better than my other half pads I have by a landslide.

I love my front rider! My saddle fits my young horse quite well so I wanted something thin with a gradual rise in the front since he is underdeveloped and has high withers. This pad did the trick! Very comfy and I feel very close to him due to the thinness of the pad.

Feels odd to the touch when you first get it, but works great for the problem I had, which was a bridging saddle.

Very nice for the horse. Great gel pad. My horse says he is happy with it.

Durable, wash and wear, tons of ventilation, and stays put. My MFT mare has high withers, a short back, and is round. Her high withers don't seem to help keep the saddle in place and only serve to push the saddle backwards on her already short back. I can't use a pad and a blanket because they will be too bulky and cause slippage. This pad would have to be placed directly on the horse if it is being used for slipping problems.Update: I have been using this for almost a year and it still looks new. I can use this pad alone for my 17' Wintec saddle with an inch or two to spare lengthwise. I have to use an additional thin pad/blanket to fit my 16' Down Under Australian saddle, as the pad is exactly the same length as the saddle and thus will sore my mare's back. Still a great way to prevent slippage but I don't see how this would fit a 16' western saddle that tends to be larger than an Australian saddle.

Works great for both horse and rider! I use it as a bareback pad with a terrycloth towel over and under it.

This was a gift and my daughter loves it...her horse does to!

The quality of this gel pad is just as described and their customer service is excellent. I would recommend this pad for any riding to cushion the horses back. Ordered the middle riser and it performed perfectly to prevent bridging that was occurring on our older horse.

I was able to have 2 pads put into one .

This product was a life saver for shimming a bridging saddle! I ordered the middle riser.

Wonderful pad ! It's very thick & provides great comfort for the horse & rider. I got he pad after the vet said our horse was back sore. After using the pad he seems much more comfortable. If you have any trouble with the pad , the customer service is top notch & really took care of the problem quickly. I was very impressed.

Works great on a thin-skinned, high withered TB mare. I was able to replace a bulkier lift pad, and feel closer, better contact but more supported. I may have to get a shorter girth. I find with her a thicker saddle pad works better. Nice product, thanks!

Ordered one of these for a imported sport friesian. He's a dressage kid and beyond sensitive! I had my doubts that this would be like most everything else and he would not approve. Long story short his Hennig saddle fits beautifully now and this allows my seatbones to touch him unlike the thick sheepskin pad! Amazing product at a wonderful price! I love kavallerie product! Most important he's happy!

Very good quality pad- a bit wide in the back so that can be a pain with my show pad, which has number pockets, but does help with back soreness. I've used this under a 17.5in dressage saddle and a 17in all purpose saddle and it was long enough for both of those, which was nice. My guy appreciates the padding, and I like the price! It is rather heavy though, heavier than I thought it would be.

Alright, we received this, and it worked great! It feels amazing, didn't slide, and we loved it. Fast forward a month later....we go to Pony Club camp. After one of her rides, she hangs it on a stall with her saddle pad. We come back 5hrs later, and it's melted IN HALF. LOL. Note...if you're in a hot climate, DO NOT LEAVE IT OUT!! Lesson learned. It would have 5 stars had it not melted a month later. By the way, we can still technically use it, because it doesn't move at all under the saddle, but I ordered another anyway. We're in Texas.

I agree that this pad feels a little weird, but it really does the job! My horse is comfortable, I am comfortable, and it really helps to stabilize my treeless dressage saddle.

Great pad!

I picked up this pad to use on a horse with a sensitive back. I was very impressed with the quality and functionality of the pad. It's strong, flexible and - most importantly - provides lots of shock absorption. My horse moved more freely on the first ride. I tried it on a few other horses with similar results. I ride dressage and it fits nicely under my 17' and 17.5' saddles. It was not as 'sticky' as I expected it to be after reading some of the reviews, but any initial stickiness dissipated after 2-3 uses. I use the standard model, but am already thinking about adding the front-riser version to my collection for horses that have a bit of a dip behind the withers to help limit the impact of the saddle while their muscles develop. It seems very durable and it is SO MUCH EASIER to care for than a pad with fleece, just hose it off an go! Great product, I would recommend it to anyone - and have recommended it to a few at my own barn!

This is like no other pad I've ever seen. I bought it because my saddle was 'bridging' and making my horses' back sore. I Looked at many, many built up pads before I decided on this. I didn't want anything that would have an edge where the built up part starts and ends as that would make a sore spot. I have used pads that were supposed to 'stay in place' before. They would work out from under the saddle and spit out the back. I am amazed and pleased with the Kavallerie Horse Saddle Pad-Anti-Slip...It does everything it says it does. My horse moved out nicely because the saddle wasn't hurting him. We were out on the trail for 5-6 hours. Up and down mountains, gaiting, galloping, walking. This pad never moved. The service/ follow up from Kavallerie is pretty amazing too. They checked to see if I received my pad and reminded me of proper care instructions. I highly recommend the Kavallerie Horse Saddle Pad.

I ordered this pad after my quarter horse gelding started acting back sore after a ride. He is very wide and although my saddle fits him properly it tends shift due to his lack of withers. He has been much more comfortable with this pad with just a thin pad beneath it and it has also stopped the problem I was having with the saddle shifting. I have also been using it on my mustang colt and it seems to be comfortable for him but he has only had a few rides - he is much narrower with prominent withers and my saddle fits him better with this pad and a thicker pad under it, still no shifting even with a thicker pad underneath. I haven't tried this pad under my western saddle yet, just my close contact jumping saddle but I'll probably try it as it seems to be a great pad. It looks like it will fit under my roping saddle okay with a thin woven pad underneath it.

I like it very much; however, I have a twenty one year old WB and I have trouble with it slipping slightly at the withers. I think it is do to hisconformation at this age. It doesn't cause any problems because it is minimal.